endorfunsports.com

[DougieFresh]

This is probably just a bug in the registration process at Active.com but as far as I can tell, there is no way to register as a Clydesdale for Timberman sprint. I assume the same form is used for the rest of the events, Mooseman, etc. You can only specify your age as of Dec. 31, 2010. Am I going blind here or am I right and the Clydes/Athena option is missing?

Thanks.

[cgcraig]

I just found out there will be no relays for Moosman (international and half) or for Timberman (sprint and half). That really bums me out because I can only do the swim and bike portion of these races and I had such a great year last year, it looks like I won't be able to do any of Keiths races.

[keithjordan]

We have relays and clydesdales at Black Fly this year.
The Aquabike thing is more due to the number of complaints we've received from athletes feeling slighted by the lack of finish line, fanfare, etc.

As for the relays and clydesdales/athenas, Ironman recognizes three categories: Age Group, Pro, and Physically Challenged for both world championships. This is a change from the past, where we were allowed to have both at the races.....

[cake73]

Wow. That's a real bummer.

I had great fun doing a 70.3 relay at Mooseman with two friends of mine and doing a 70.3 relay at Timberman where I swam and cycled and my husband ran. It had been a dream of mine, ever since I first started to do triathlons, to do a relay with my husband, knowing that it would have to be one of a longer distance to really get him excited. I am *so* glad I decided to fulfill this dream in 2009.

I believe the relays at Mooseman and Timberman were quite popular and, no doubt, will be *very much* missed.

I can understand the Aquabike folks wanting a bit of a finish line instead of just stopping in the transition area. I guess there's still iDNF as an option.

That said, I plan on being at both Mooseman and Timberman this year.

[DougieFresh]

>>>
As for the relays and clydesdales/athenas, Ironman recognizes three categories: Age Group, Pro, and Physically Challenged for both world championships. This is a change from the past, where we were allowed to have both at the races.....
<<<

Wow, I can't believe there won't be a Clydes division at the Timberman sprint or even any relay teams.

So, this really holds for Mooseman Int'l and Timberman sprint too because the 70.3 races are part of Ironman? Those were the races I was trying to sign up for, the Int'l and sprint respectively, not the 70.3.

[cgcraig]

In other races, it is common the aquabikes are re-routed to another area where they rack their bikes and run over the finishline. It is a great feeling to cross over, have your picture taken, & get your medal. I can understand why this would be an issue. After all, they paid the same amount as everyone else and it would be great to have a "photo" finish. With that said, why was it easier to eliminate this division versus making a path through the parking lot?

[keithjordan]

It'd be a fairly long run at the events, which considering the fact that it's an AQUABIKE, I felt that having folks RUN for 200 or so yds probably wasn't the best idea. I could see folks trying to outrun each other to place higher, and injuring themselves worse. Most of the aquabikers have running injuries, which is why they're participating.

I've always felt that if we couldn't offer a first-rate experience, we shouldn't do it....

Logistically, it's really tough for us. Additionally, Ironman doesn't recognize Aquabike as an official category for 70.3.

[cake73]

Honestly, the association with Ironman 70.3 was never a draw for me to participate in Timberman and it won't be the reason I participate at Mooseman. It's the endorfun reputation for putting on quality, fun events that compelled me to sign up and participate in 2009.

While I look forward to participating as a single athlete, I am bummed that I won't have the opportunity to be part of a relay team with friends and family at a Timberman or Mooseman event in the future.

[suzys]

Endorfun's events have been the most prestigious races in the New England area for a long time, at least I feel that way. Keith and his organization should be justifiably proud that the M-dot brand recognizes their organization and first-class operation. What is disappointing is that by taking away the aquabike and relay categories, it eliminates avenues that have encouraged so many regional athletes to increase their challenge levels of distance participation. That's part of a "first-rate" experience to be able to have this type of venue, with such a quality organization, in our back yard.

I started participating in triathlons 5 years ago, at age 50. The idea of completing a full 70.3 seemed like a pipe-dream, but having relays and aquabikes available made it possible for me to train and participate well beyond my initial comfort level. I first came to Timberman as a volunteer with a friend, and in support of another friend who was participating on a relay team. I saw first-hand how well organized Endorfun events are, m-dot or not. In 2009, I experienced the races themselves...as the runner on a relay team at Mooseman, then completing my first full 70.3 at Timberman. Without having relays and aquabike levels available, this experience may not happen for upcoming athletes, and I think that's a sad thing to lose in New England.

[keithjordan]

Thanks for the kind words! Isn't that what the short course races are for? to welcome everyone to the sport, get them involved, etc?

We still have Timberman Sprint, and have 2 short course races at Black Fly, which are awesome, IMO.

Black Fly also has a RELAY.

Then, there's another stepping stone in the International at Mooseman.

Trust me, I understand, and have been trying for 10 years to be everything to everyone. It's tough to do!!!!!!


My wife, who handles registration, has been begging me to get rid of the relays for YEARS. It's a registration nightmare, and has her in tears at least a couple of times before a race. The amount of switching teammates, changing of divisions due to this, etc THE WEEK OF THE RACE is unbelievable. We never wanted to disappoint folks, and inevitably one of the team members got hurt, couldn't make it. So, we'd end up having to redo a bunch of things so the team could still participate. We also had

This isn't whining, so don't take it as such. BUT, it's been a bigger issue over the years than folks know.

I certainly want to be all-inclusive. It's why I got into this, and the first-timers have a HUGE spot in my heart....

[jmelanson]

I too am disappointed with the elimination of the Aquabike division. I cannot run so I never thought of triathlons until I realized there was the Aquabike division.

So I signed up for my first Timberman (Aquabike) two years ago as an incentive to train and felt great satisfaction when I finished the race the last two years.

I understand the issue of not having a finish line but it seems so minor to me in comparison with the privilege of being able to compete in a great race. I believe there were almost 100 participants for the Aquabike this year.

And yes there is a Sprint if one can work their way up to running 3 miles somehow but the longer two distances in the Aquabike really gave me a sense of satisfaction a Sprint could not even if I were able to run.

Having said all that the race is fantastic and I would show up as a spectator.

[MNix]

All inclusive? Hardly – by eliminating relay teams and aquabikers you have excluded well over 500 athletes that competed in Mooseman and Timberman this year. I suspect if you took a poll of the aquabikers most would have preferred to finish without the fanfare if their other option was no race at all.

It has been suggested that the aquabikers can still sign up for the race and just do the swim and bike. How is the finish line any different in that scenario? What’s worse, the official result is a DNF and we don’t get the finisher’s swag (towel, water bottle, etc.). Not that these items have any great monetary value but they are a symbol that the athlete competed and finished. Signing up for the full race and just doing the swim and bike is not a fair alternative.

As far as the issues encountered with swapping out relay team members, I totally understand you wanting to accommodate for injuries, etc. However, last minute changes could be eliminated by having a cut-off date for substitutions – no exceptions. I’m sure the relay teams that have participated in the past would have been more than willing to live with that rule rather than having relay teams eliminated altogether.

By eliminating relay teams and aquabikers you are excluding triathletes that don’t fit into the traditional mold. The logic for eliminating these groups just does not add up … perhaps it is to make way for more of the “big dogs” to come to town. There are a lot of local, average athletes that have supported these two races for years, not to mention their families and friends that volunteer and otherwise support the entire concept of having these races in the area. Now on the 10th anniversary of Timberman these non-traditional triathletes have been blocked from participating. How very disappointing.

[josh@pennhill.com]

I have no problem with this -- these are long distance triathlons. Not relay races -- not duathlons -- no need to have weight divisions. Heck -- I could care less if we had age divisions.

Keep it simple: swim bike run -- if you don't want to or can't run (or bike) --- don't. Just do what you can do and call it quits.

Who cares ? -- world peace is not at stake -- no one but ourselves care how we do -- who cares if someone else was faster or slower? - the goal should be to the best you can be -- mentally and physically.

If for whatever reason -- WTC rules / logistics / etc -- these divisions are being eliminated -- so what. I personally am incredibly grateful for Keith et alia for putting on these events and if simplifying allows his company to continue organizing these events then so be it.

For what it's worth - I've had to only do swim/bike in previous years and I still had a blast -- I don't care how my time compares to others.

-- so lighten up everyone - we're basically talking about narcassistic recreation here - not homelessness, hunger or world peace.

*** Have Fun - Tri Hard - Be Kind ***
--josh

[keithjordan]

Ironman recognizes Age Group, Pro, and Physically-Challenged divisions.
I believe they're trying to standardize this for all Ironman 70.3 and Ironman events.

I understand the frustration, but I also understand the other side of things.

The idea that it's to let more "big dogs" do the race is just not true. We love the first-timers and ALL athletes. It's why we do what we do. I think anyone who's done our races know we do it because we love it. It's WAAAAAAY too much work/stress to do it for any other reason.


It's an effort on Ironman's part to standardize. In the end it is a TRIATHLON. I know folks don't want to hear it, but I have to respect it and honor it. Aquabike folks can still participate, just in a different way. I also understand your frustration on this....

As mentioned, we still have relays for Black Fly, and look forward to it.